SPOILER DISCUSSION

So Walter experimented on her. Sure, she has a right. But Walter not only experimented on, but kidnapped and lied to Peter, and left him fatherless during his teenage years and when his mother died. And Peter has no right to get mad? Peter has every right moreso than anyone else and he still hasn't got mad :/

I just think that sometimes, people's Fringe-worlds revolve around Olivia so much, they can't see the other characters. We can't do that with Peter, we have to acknowledge Olivia :/

Oh my God what's he done now? Or is it just because Olivia, the centre of the universe might get a bit sad he impregnated the wrong her? It's fine though, he totally meant to and he's going to be totally thrilled by the kid. Peter's stupid and selfish for having sex with the woman he thought he was with. Don't know any other guy in the world as terrible as that.

No, they'd better not play it that way. I really, really hope this storyline isn't true.

Not only has Peter been borderline raped by this woman and she has ripped away any of the last trust he had in ANYONE around him ... but now we are about to find out she has used him to HAVE HIS CHILD? Without him having ANY idea, and completely and totally against his will. This is the most fucked up situation in the world.

IDK I really don't wan't them to go forth with this plot I just find it sixteen different levels of disgusting. She has taken his entire life out of his hands. And he's only just found out that Walter had done the same thing. Oh god Peter.

monnie44 wrote:

Oh my God what's he done now? Or is it just because Olivia, the centre of the universe might get a bit sad he impregnated the wrong her? It's fine though, he totally meant to and he's going to be totally thrilled by the kid. Peter's stupid and selfish for having sex with the woman he thought he was with. Don't know any other guy in the world as terrible as that.

No, they'd better not play it that way. I really, really hope this storyline isn't true.

Not only has Peter been borderline raped by this woman and she has ripped away any of the last trust he had in ANYONE around him ... but now we are about to find out she has used him to HAVE HIS CHILD? Without him having ANY idea, and completely and totally against his will. This is the most fucked up situation in the world.

IDK I really don't wan't them to go forth with this plot I just find it sixteen different levels of disgusting. She has taken his entire life out of his hands. And he's only just found out that Walter had done the same thing. Oh god Peter.

SEE. All of this. Why does no one else see what we see? It's really upsetting :/

Because to see all of that would mean seeing Olivia and Walter as in the wrong which people can't seem to do. Walter's a bastard and a child abuser but he's funny so people don't realize what he's done. Olivia's been portrayed as strong so when she cries it's this huge deal. But Peter's always been shown as a sarcastic cynic and people just have this negative view of him.
To be fair, I think it's down to the writers more than the fans. If they'd write Peter better, show some of his emotions, people would sympathize with him more easily.

As to the Altlivia thing - I only just kinda got that he sort of was raped by her. Do you think that's even crossed their minds? I mean Frank was away so it never happened to Olivia but woah. And they won't deal with it because it was a guy who was the victim and that's apparently fine. He didn't give her consent, he gave the person he thought she was consent D:

If Altlivia's pregnant and she did just use him for a baby (although I can't see how. She didn't even want to have sex with him, so I can't see how a pregnancy would be part of her plan) or now she's got the kid and Walternate's gonna use that to his advantage, you just know Peter's gonna get like 2 scenes if we're lucky and we're gonna be shown how hurt Olivia is.

The guy barely knows who he is, his whole life's just been messed up completely and he can't trust anyone to help him. I understand why people sympathize with Olivia because it's kinda got to be hard to come back from whatever and no one realizing you've gone, but not for blaming Peter, especially because you saw how sorry he was and he admitted to her straight away what he'd done, whereas with Olivia she wanted to get him back to the blueverse asap and bullshitted him to get him to come back. But, no, the guy's a monster because in his entire shitty life he held on to the only piece of happiness he had. But again, it comes down to the way they wrote it. If they hadn't made Olivia so obvious - even if they left out that scene about her being a "whole other person" in DSDOES in Massive Dynamic, maybe people could sympathize more with him.

I know I've basically repeated everything I or any of you guys have said previously but Christ I am so annoyed right now.

Because to see all of that would mean seeing Olivia and Walter as in the wrong which people can't seem to do. Walter's a bastard and a child abuser but he's funny so people don't realize what he's done.

I'm glad you brought this up. I am astounded sometimes when I get into discussions with people and they seem to be under the impression that Walter has done everything because of his love for his son.

I partly blame the episode "Peter" for this attitude towards Walter, and I feel the need to mention that the story being told in that episode was being told by a HIGHLY UNRELIABLE NARRATOR. The entire thing was from Walter's perspective and from Walter's mouth - I am surprised at how many people trust him to be entirely accurate, especially on this subject. I feel like writing an entire post on this, actually, so here's a bit more of an explanation:

From the Pilot, it has been shown to us that:
- Peter has had a lifelong, HORRIBLE relationship with his father.
- He has mentioned (and he has no reason to lie) that Walter spent all his time at work, at the expense of time with Peter.
- When Walter left for the institution it was the start of THE ONLY PEACFUL TIME in Peter's family life (note the ONLY in Peter's quote).
- That Walter payed so little attention to his son that when Peter started to lose weight at the summer before high school Walter did not even notice.
- Peter was so upset at Walter he sold all his precious books to get back at him (whether he regretted this later on doesn't matter - the feelings were strong enough when they were there to make him do it in the first place).
- Peter never once visited Walter in St Claires - you don't do that to someone who only cared about and loved you all your childhood.
- He was prepared to let Scott die so that he didn't have to see his father.
- Walter used to SHOCK HIM WITH CAR BATTERIES.
- Guaranteed there's a lot we haven't heard yet (and I read a casting side a few weeks ago - very spoilerish so I won't say what - that would hint at much more abuse done to that poor boy).

Now, taking this into account, it is fairly obvious Peter has been seriously mistreated by Walter for his entire life up to the point Walter was instatutionalised. At this point, we know that Bell removed those pieces of his brain for the purpose of stopping him from "the man he is becomming" (in my mind - he WAS our side's Walternate at this point. And that moment in Grey Matters where Walter is given access to those missing pieces - his demeaner, his smugness - would imply that I am at least partially correct). From this point, and from the subsequent seventeen years he was locked away - the medications, the time for reflection, the missing memories and changed brain chemistry due to the brain surgery - Walter became a different man.

He meets Peter again. He realised during his stay at St Claires that Peter was the only thing he had left in the world - he had lost his career, his wife, his home, his life - and this clearly prompted him to want to salvage what he had. On top of this, for a while, it seems that as memories were beginning to come back to him over the first few seasons, Walter seems to mistake his love for Peter for the love for his dead son. He finally comes to love Peter as his OTHER son - a seperate entity, not one and the same - somewhere in season two. And then comes the point where he realises he could lose this kid forever as well, and that he desperately doesn't want to.

Keeping this in mind, is it ANY SURPRISE that when he retells the story of Peter's kidnapping (a kidnapping that gave Peter NIGHTMARES - so there was something there that has terrified and traumatised that child) that Walter is a highly biased, highly unreliable narrator for this particular tale? He is projecting his CURRENT love and care for Peter, mixed with the distraught feelings over losing HIS son, and allowing them to colour his memory of this particular event. For all we know parts of it are completely fabricated - what if chunks of that memory were removed by Bell's surgery and Walter has replaced then with what he THINKS might have happened?

Because if Walter was as desperate and as caring a man that he deeply regretted not allowing his son to make any friends due to his illness, and went to another universe MERELY TO SAVE ANOTHER MAN'S PETER, how could he have turned such a gigantic 180 into the bastard of a man Peter remembers him to be? I just can't buy it.

I do think there's truth in the story he told Olivia about the kidnapping - but I also think there's a lot of projection in there and parts are partially, if not completely, fabricated to suit what Walter wants to believe, and what he wants Olivia to believe.

Putting this in a seperate post because the other one was far too long.

As to the Altlivia thing - I only just kinda got that he sort of was raped by her. Do you think that's even crossed their minds? I mean Frank was away so it never happened to Olivia but woah. And they won't deal with it because it was a guy who was the victim and that's apparently fine. He didn't give her consent, he gave the person he thought she was consent D:

I brought this up a while ago in TWoP and there were also these people arguing it doesn't count as rape. Not ... really the point of me bringing that up, but what a way to turn the conversation in order to allow people to further discredit how Peter is a major victim in this as well.

In my mind if Olivia had been in Peter's situation people would be talking about how she got physically violated as well as mentally for sure, and it's the same thing as if a woman was tricked into sleeping with her boyfriend's twin brother while believing it was her boyfriend. I consider that rape - the victim CANNOT consent because they have not consented to the right person. Regardless, the fact is that Peter has been abused by Altlivia already. To go and then have her GET PREGNANT without his knowledge, and again, WITHOUT HIS CONSENT, is just an utterly filthy, revolting act.

And I don't think they will address this. I can't have this storyline happen for that reason the most - because forcing a CHILD onto a man that you have basically RAPED is absolutely disgusting, and I would NOT be able to focus on whatever plot they're going to work this into because the only thing I'll be able to think about is how sickeningly wrong that is. Not to say that the child itself is at fault here, but Altlivia and Walternate will have RUINED PETER'S LIFE. He didn't MAKE that mistake - it wasn't a MISTAKE, it wasn't an ACCIDENTAL conception - she has forced this child on him against his will, and taken the decision entirely out of his hands. I wish there was another word I could use other than unfair, because unfair does not sum this up.

I just can't see how Peter will cope with this. Especially if Altlivia dies (and I have a strong feeling if she is indeed pregnant, she will end up dying) and the raising of the child automatically must be done by him.

What would he do? Just decide to take care of the baby? Just like that?

I can't fathom how this wont snap Peter in two.

This is probably off topic but FHDKFJAHFHA

THE PRESS RELEASE. FOR 3.11. PETER. THE MACHINE. WALTER BEING SCARED. WITH NINA. AT MASSIVE DYNAMIC. OMG. AND IM SURE YOU GUYS WILL LIKE THAT THERE WERE NO MENTIONS OF OLIVIA AT ALL.

BUT SJKFHAHD. I CAN'T WAIT.

You got the Peter/Walter thing entirely right. I'm kinda suspicious of the episode Peter too but I don't think we'll come back to it and I don't think we're even gonna get back into the Peter/Walter relationship :/
(Sorry for the shortness, I'm getting so tired right now D:)

If Altlivia's pregnant (I just posted a rant about this in the rant section xD) then it really is gonna break Peter. But we're likely not to be shown that. The whole rape thing is ridiculous. If it was the opposite way round, Peternate tricking Olivia into sex while Peter was stuck on the other side, everyone'd scream rape. But I don't think it's even crossed their minds.

I posted on Fringebloggres something about the lack of sympathy for Peter and I got a response talking about how he was too chirpy after he first told Olivia and how he wasn't paying attention in Barrett's garden. I can't even reply. I got too mad xD

But the PRESS RELEASE <3 Olivia's not even mentioned! But now I'm kinda concerned their whack-a-mole may have moved back to Walter instead of onto Peter :/ WE SHALL SEE.

I want to vomit at how perfect them posts were ;___________;

Though I come bearing news. Good news.
Apparently, someone from Grey's Anatomy was announced pregnant last night, she was on EOnline's "Who's pregnant?" poll.

Also! AWESOMESAUCE PRESS RELEASE FOR 3X11:

TWO INCIDENTS TRIGGER ONE MASSIVE INVESTIGATION ON AN ALL-NEW “FRINGE” FRIDAY, JANUARY 28, ON FOX

When the Fringe Team visits Massive Dynamic’s assembly of doomsday device, Walter becomes greatly concerned for Peter’s well-being, so he turns to Nina for added brain power to understand the relationship between Peter and the superweapon. Meanwhile, the discovery of a dead body triggers an intense investigation in the all-new “Reciprocity” episode of FRINGE airing Friday, Jan. 28

ALTLIVIA ISN'T PREGNANT?! YESSSSSS


Can Peter still be pregnant?


THERE IS NO OLIVIA >

WELL I THINK SHE ISN'T, BUT ONE OF THE FEW PEOPLE WHO WANTED HER TO BE, SAID THAT MAYBE EONLINE AREN'T IN THE KNOW ABOUT ALTLIV. BUT ANYWAY, APPARENTLY ONLY ONE OF THE WOMEN ON THE LIST HAS THE PREGNANCY STORYLINE AND, AS I LOOK AT IT, THEY WOULDN'T HAVE INCLUDED SOMEONE THEY HAD NO CLUE ABOUT. THEY RELEASED THE POLL THE DAY AFTER THE FANS JUMPED ON THE THEORY, THEY WERE PROBABLY MESSING WITH US :')

OH THANK BABY JESUS IF SHE'S NOT PREGNANT.

Peter was still raped, though D:

SHE CAN'T BE PREGNANT. HE'LL'VE USED PROTECTION WALTER WARNED HIM ALL THROUGH SEASON ON- OMG. HE DIDN'T USE PROTECTION JUST TO SPITE WALTER.

SHE IS PREGNANT! XD

I KNOW RIGHT. THAT WOULD HAVE CRUSHED ME SO MUCH.

Right? OMG. LOOK THROUGH MY POSTS FROM TODAY ON TUMBLR. LAUREN POSTED A DEFENSE OF PETER, TRYING TO GET PEOPLE TO SEE HIS VIEW. I'M EVEN MORE IN LOVE WITH HER. SHE SPOKE OUR THOUGHTS.

LOLOLOLOLOLOL ON A SERIOUS NOTE THOUGH, I THINK PETER LOVES OLIVIA ENOUGH HE'D TRY TO BE SEROUS AN SENSIBLE WITH HER. WHAT I HATE IS WHEN PEOPLE SAY THAT OLIVIA'S PROVED HER LOVE TO PETER AND NOW HE HAS TO PROVE HIS. HE SPENT TWO FUCKING SEASONS PROVING HIS. SHE JUST RANDOMLY DECIDED IN THE MIDDLE OF SEASON 2 THAT SHE LIKED HIM.

DID LAUREN GET FLAMED FOR IT? D:

YOU ARE SO RIGHT. HE GAVE UP HIS LIFE FOR HER. HE GAVE UP HIS WORLD FOR HER. HE PUT UP WITH SO MUCH FOR HER. WHAT'S SHE DONE FOR HIM EXCEPT IMAGINE HIM OVER THERE?

I DIDN'T ACTUALLY LOOK WHAT ANYONE ELSE SAID, I JUST JIZZED OVER THE POST XD

YOU KNOW WHAT I WAS THINKING ABOUT IN LAW TODAY?

PETER ONLY CAME BACK TO THIS UNIVERSE FOR OLIVIA. SHE HATES HIM AND DOESN;T WANT HIM.
HE WON'T GO OVER THERE BECUASE THEY ALL USE HIM, TOO.

HE NO LONGER HAS ANY REASON TO STAY ANYWHERE. HE SHOULD JUST HAVE A SERIES OF NORHTWEST PASSAGES. I'D BE HAPPY. :'D

A SPIN OFF SHOW FOCUSING ON HIS HEARTBROKEN SEARCH TO FIND A PLACE WHERE HE BELONGS? AND HE FINDS IT IN WHITE COLLAR, WITH NEAL?

I WAS IN BIOLOGY TODAY AND WE'RE DOING ABOUT DNA. ALL THE FRIGGING LESSON ALL I COULD THINK OF WAS PETER, THE MACHINE, AND PETER AND NEAL XD

I JUST FEEL SO BAD FOR HIM. HE DOESN'T HAVE ANYWHERE IN THE MULTIVERSE TO GO. I WANT WALTER TO SIDE WITH HIM SO MUCH OLIVIA'S INTIMIDATED. I JUST WANT WALTER TO GET FIERCELY PROTECTIVE.

HOLY MOTHER FUCK YES. I WOULD WATCH AND WORSHIP THAT SHOW *___________*

ASDFGHJKSDFGHJK HOW ARE WE SUPPOSED TO DO WELL I COLLEGE WHEN EVRYTHING RELATES TO FRINGE, PETER OR CONPORN? XD

RIGHT? I JUST NEED MORE PETER AND WALTER, THEY COULD DO SO MUCH WITH THIS RELATIONSHIP, IT'S MASSIVELY COMPLEX :/

I'D MAKE THE SHOW MY RELIGION AND MY GOD AND MY BIBLE AND MY CONDOMS.

IKR? I'M GENUINELY SCAIRT THAT IN MY LAW EXAM I'M GONNA HAVE TO DEFEND A HOMOSEXUAL COUPLE CALLED PETER AND NEAL CAUSE I SWEAR IF THAT HAPPENS I'M WRITING FANFICTION INSTEAD.

WE DON'T NEED PETER/OLIVIA. THE OLIVIA FANS THINK PETER DOESN'T DESERVE OLIVIA, THE PETER FANS DON'T THINK OLIVIA DOESN'T DESERVE PETER - JUST LET OLIVIA SCREW SAM WEISS SO THEY CAN BE ANNOYING TOGETHER AND TURN PETER GAY. GOOD. THAT'S SORTED. NOW LET'S FOCUS ON THE MOST INTERESTING AND UNIQUE RELATIONSHIP ON THE SHOW. NOT EVEN ON THE SHOW. IT'S ONE OF THE MOST INTERESTING AND UNIQUE RELATIONSHIPS ON TV BUT THEY'RE FORGETTING ABOUT IT D:<

PETER ONLY CAME BACK TO THIS UNIVERSE FOR OLIVIA. SHE HATES HIM AND DOESN;T WANT HIM.
HE WON'T GO OVER THERE BECUASE THEY ALL USE HIM, TOO.

HE NO LONGER HAS ANY REASON TO STAY ANYWHERE.

This is an idea which calls me to it, and I would love to write about it, because there is SO much potential here for serious angst on the show. He doesn't have a reason to stay anywhere, he feels betrayed by EVERYONE who has ever meant anything to him in his life (Walter, his dead mother, Walternate, 'Olivia') and he's got all this guilt upon his shoulders because of Olivia getting hurt and him not noticing it was her. He can't have a truthful heart-to-heart with Walter because he still hasn't DEALT with Walter, so he ultimately has no real support.

How easy would it be to imagine Peter going completely off the rails? And I don't mean what he's done before - because he has for most of his life been "off the rails" - I mean seriously messed up. Suicical. If he finds out that his suspicions are correct and it is HIS duty to destroy one or another of his worlds, and that he knows he is meant to be in the red to restore balance, but CAN'T live there, where does this put him? What if he can't handle the pressure? Two WORLDS of peoples lives, relying on him to kill or save them. Unfortunately I could see Peter taking the cowards way out, and some parts of me wish we could get a one episode glimpse into "the road not taken" where he DOES blow his brains out in front of everyone, and they're left to deal with the mess of somehow surviving when they have lost their ONLY tool of survival.

I JUST FEEL SO BAD FOR HIM. HE DOESN'T HAVE ANYWHERE IN THE MULTIVERSE TO GO. I WANT WALTER TO SIDE WITH HIM SO MUCH OLIVIA'S INTIMIDATED. I JUST WANT WALTER TO GET FIERCELY PROTECTIVE.

THE SUM OF MONEY I WOULD PAY FOR THIS SCENE.

I WOULD LOVE WALTER TO ACTUALLY TELL OLIVIA OFF IN A FUTURE EPISODE IF SHE IS STILL GIVING PETER THE COLD SHOULDER. I MEAN, PETER IS WALTER'S SON - HE HAS PRIORITY OVER EVERYONE ELSE. WALTER WOULD HAVE EVERY RIGHT AS A FATHER TO PUT HER ASS BACK IN PLACE BECAUSE HIS SON SPENT THOSE WEEKS OVER THE MOON BECAUSE HE THOUGHT HE WAS DATING HER, THOUGHT HE WAS LOVING HER, AND HE WAS TRYING HIS HARDEST TO MAKE THE RELATIONSHIP WORK FOR HER - NOT ALTLIVIA. AND THAT PETER DOESN'T SLEEP RIGHT ANYMORE AND HE'S ALWAYS UPSET AND WALTER CAN'T STAND WATCHING HIS SON LOOK SO GUILTY ALL THE TIME AND SPEND EVERY DAY TRYING TO PLEASE OLIVIA AND MAKE IT UP TO HER, ONLY FOR HER TO BE A SELFISH BITCH AND NOT CONSIDER HIS SITUATION. UGH WALTER WOULD BRING IT SO HARD.

OMG TELL ME YOU GUYS HAVE SEEN THE CONVULSING PETER CLIP???
OMG. AND IT'S NOT THE SAME SCENE AS THE ONE WHERE HE GETS SHOT - HE'S ON A FLOOR IN A BUILDING THIS TIME. WHEN HE GETS SHOT HE IS LYING ON GRAVEL. BUT HE IS WEARING THE SAME CLOTHES SO I'M WONDERING IF HE IS INTIALLY OKAY AFTER THE OBSERVER SHOOTS HIM, AND HAS THE SEIZURE LATER ON? SO MAYBE HE GETS SHOT EARLIER IN THE EPISODE?

FUCK I CANNOT WAIT ANYMORE NOW. TWO HURT PETER SCENES IN ONE EPISODE? I'M DYING HERE JESUS FUCK I CAN'T WAIT A WEEK NO GIVE ME IT NOW.

I'M GONNA REPLY TO THE VIDEO FIRST CAUSE I JUST REWATCHED IT AND I CAN'T EVEN STOP THROWING UP RAINBOWS.
I THINK PETER MAY ACTUALLY BE FOCUSED ON HERE. AND IF NOT, FUCKING PETER WHUMP TWICE AND OH MY GOD. OH MY GOD. I CANNOT WAIT AN ENTIRE WEEK WTF IS THIS? WHY DOES TIME NOT OBEY ME?

HOLY SHIT. HAVE YOU SEEN THE NEW PROMO TOO? OLIVIA'S DRESSED UP A LITTLE AT THE END. THAT'S CONFUSED ME.

Now to reply to your non capslock post

I'd love to see him suicidal. I can totally see him being that way and I can see him acting on it. He'll think he's being noble, he's restoring balance, he's saving universes. And at the same time he's doing what he's always done and is running from his pain. I think he would be suicidal and I'm hoping for an episode where he attempts it. But fails, obviously, cause a Joshless Fringe is a Daniless Fringe.

I just wanna see Walter act like Peter's father rather than his kid. Just take Olivia to one side and kick her ass. Be all "I know you think I'm insane, but I pick up a lot more than I let on," all lucid and frightening. "He has been through hell and you are not making it any easier. Bitch." xD

GUYS. THAT PROMO MADE ME STOP BREATHING AND BLINKING. I CRIED IN EXCITEMENT. I FEEL SICK I NEED IT THAT BAD.

FUCKING CONVULSIONS. OMG. THEY OWN ME, NOW.
AND PETER LOOKING DESPERATE WHILE HE WANTS TO CROSS THE STREET TO THE OBSERVER <3
"EVERY TIME THE OBSERVER SHOWS UP, IT HAS SOMETHING TO DO WITH YOU."
ASDFGHJKL;SDFGHKL;K

THE OTHER PROMO. THE MACHINE. HOLY SHIT. I THINK I'M THE ONY FRINGIE WHO'S NOT INTERETED IN OLIVIA DRESSED UP - BUT WHATEVER.

AND BOTH OF YOU TALKING ABOUT WALTER BEING A BITCH TO OLIVIA HAVE MADE MY DAY. SHE NEEDS TO BE SLAPPED SO SHE CAN SEE SOMEONE OTHER THAN HERSELF FOR ONCE.

BREATHE KAYLA BREATHE. I THINK I WAS ABOUT 2 SECONDS AWAY FROM DYING THERE BECAUSE I LITERALLY FORGOT HOW TO BREATHE.

PETER CONVULSING.

PETER CONVUSLING.

PETER CONVULSING.

PETER CONVULSING.

PETER CONVULSING.

PETER CONVULSING.

NOTHING ELSE MATTERS IN THE WORLD RIGHT NOW.

IS THIS REAL LIFE? FRIDAY, COME FASTERRRRR.

and Olivia? In a dress? With a gun? And the lipstick? Whatttt?

THE IMAGE OF HIM BEING SHOT AND CONVULSING HAS BEEN STUCK IN MY HEAD SINCE I SAW IT.
IT'S ALL I CARE ABOUT.
I NEED IT TO SURVIVE.